The German source could have been talking about the EU market where consumers are typically ripped off far more than in the US.

As Demon posts, did you take VAT into account?

Windows 7 pre-order was a much better deal. Ditto for Windows 8.

Free upgrade path is pretty worthless for anyone who wishes to retain their old OS. Best option now seems to be the free upgrade just before MS withdraw the offer. Software is bad enough on a mature OS never mind early days if a new OS. MS should give 12 month dual boot period and preferably longer.

At these prices Windows 10 is now on my ignore list for 12 months. After 12 months worth of bug fixes I might risk it.

Whats wrong with a disk. You can store them forever.

jigger
Whats wrong with a disk. You can store them forever.

Because many thin and light devices aren't don't have DVD drives.

jigger
Whats wrong with a disk. You can store them forever.

Actually typical cd/dvd discs start breaking down after a certain period, the bond between the plastic layers tends to be the main problem but also the plastic itself becomes more and more brittle until hairline cracks start penetrating through and making the disc unreadable . It all depends on the disc manufacturer but 10-15 years seems about average from my experience.

Optical disc decay is primarily driven by oxidation, contaminants, and UV radiation. If the disks are clean, stored in a solid opaque sealed container with little room for air, there's no reason why they shouldn't outlast you. But still, certainly not forever.

aidanjt
Optical disc decay is primarily driven by oxidation, contaminants, and UV radiation. If the disks are clean, stored in a solid opaque sealed container with little room for air, there's no reason why they shouldn't outlast you. But still, certainly not forever.

I've always looked after my discs yet there is no way any of them will out last me, I always wipe off any dust or fingerprints I see with a soft cloth before returning them to the box they came in and placing them either on a purpose made DVD carousel or to a shelf with other dvds. Since about 2000-2005 when I used to buy loads of movies and tv shows on dvd, I have about 350, maybe around 10% won't play any more :( Anyway i'll be happy when discs are completely replaced by something more robust such as the USB memory stick.

I also see the whole optical disc scenario as a big con, originally CD's were presented at trade shows and the like and were made with completely different materials, they were so tough and scratch resistant you could happily run a steam roller over them without causing harm. Fast forward a couple years when they hit the market and they were made of a flimsy plastic which was very susceptible to scratching. The whole optical disc thing to me is just a replay of when they invented nylon stockings, at first they were basically indestructible there is a famous photo of a car towing a trailer using a pair of nylons to connect the two. The problem is they quickly realised they couldn't keep milking money out of people if the stockings would last a lifetime.

DemonHighwayman
Actually typical cd/dvd discs start breaking down after a certain period, the bond between the plastic layers tends to be the main problem but also the plastic itself becomes more and more brittle until hairline cracks start penetrating through and making the disc unreadable . It all depends on the disc manufacturer but 10-15 years seems about average from my experience.

I've got discs that are certainly more than 20 years old and work just fine. I have audio CDs from the early eights that are like new. I can't say the same for any USB pen.

jigger
I've got discs that are certainly more than 20 years old and work just fine. I have audio CDs from the early eights that are like new. I can't say the same for any USB pen.

I don't remember there even being audio CD's in the early 80's, early 90's yes. Perhaps i'm just unlucky with the stuff i've bought. Your probably right about USB not lasting a long time either but they have to last longer than easily scratched optical discs surely.

DemonHighwayman
I don't remember there even being audio CD's in the early 80's, early 90's yes. Perhaps i'm just unlucky with the stuff i've bought. Your probably right about USB not lasting a long time either but they have to last longer than easily scratched optical discs surely.

It could the late 80's TBH. But optical discs will certainly last a very long time and don't suffer data loss from storage or USB failure rates.

jigger
don't suffer data loss from storage…

Well they do, they still decay in storage, the rate is just slowed considerably if they're stored in the right conditions.

Inevitably, we're going to have to use more advanced filesystems with built in redundancy and error correction and bounce data between drives as they age, with much greater reverence for the irreplaceable over the replaceable.

DemonHighwayman
I don't remember there even being audio CD's in the early 80's, early 90's yes. Perhaps i'm just unlucky with the stuff i've bought. Your probably right about USB not lasting a long time either but they have to last longer than easily scratched optical discs surely.

That would be faulty memory, then. ;)

I bought my first CD player, a Technic SL-P3, in 1985, and I waited until there was a reasonable catalogue of discs (that suited my taste in music) before I did so. I still have it too, though it's a backup machine for a Marantz KI-Sig (*) I bought … oh, about 10 or 12 years years later?

As an example, I bought a Camel “Snow Goose” CD quite early, and I think, same day I bought the (Technics) player. According to discogs, that was released March 1983. I just played it. Works fine. :D



(*) For anyone interested, CD63 MkII KI-Sig. Also have a CD63SE on a different system which, for my money, was very nearly as good and a LOT less, in comparative terms. The KI is better, but not by enough to justify the jump in price. Not to me, anyway. But I wanted the KI. ;)

Re: USB duration

Wasn't there a story not that long ago on how the data integrity decreases rapidly with temperature (and to less than a month in some cases at temperatures that are not inconceivable for certain parts of the world - though highly unlikely here in the UK). That would make USB a very poor choice for media storage in the medium-long term.

Saracen
That would be faulty memory, then. ;)
……………..

(*) For anyone interested, CD63 MkII KI-Sig. Also have a CD63SE on a different system which, for my money, was very nearly as good and a LOT less, in comparative terms. The KI is better, but not by enough to justify the jump in price. Not to me, anyway. But I wanted the KI. ;)

Ah the good old Marantz CD63se. Still have one tucked away in the loft which I got out the other day to see if it still worked. And yes hooked up to my Arcam Alpha 5+ amp (now used for PC duties) it still sounded as sweet as I remembered.

I think this is a welcome change. I'd much rather have GTA 5 like this than on a stack of DVDs.